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my post seeking for a programmer) got removed????? 
 
lotusseedsD
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Is is my imagination? I posted a message some 30 minutes ago looking for a programmer got removed?

Is this not the right forum to post? if yes, which is appropriate place?

thank you.

 
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RoyRubin
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The Job Board is the appropriate place. Solicitation is not allowed as per the forum rules.

 
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lotusseedsD
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RoyRubin - 15 April 2008 12:55 PM

The Job Board is the appropriate place. Solicitation is not allowed as per the forum rules.

Sorry, Roy, I didn’t aware of this. I saw posts before that people were looking for designers and programmers and I didn’t see the ‘not allowed’ reply.

Job Board it is.

 
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lilquit
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Job board is $75 per post? Good luck with that.

 
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RoyRubin
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Thank you. Much appreciated.

 
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KonstantinDK
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RoyRubin - 15 April 2008 12:55 PM

The Job Board is the appropriate place. Solicitation is not allowed as per the forum rules.

The forum rules is a blank page.

http://www.magentocommerce.com/company/forum-rules/

 
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Danimaltron
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I like Magento and agree with how they are approaching building a business around an open source product. However, puting limitations on people simply looking to hire people is backwards.

Varien should be encouraging product adoption. If someone is looking for a Megnto expert, they should not get charged to do so. Instead, come up with ways of charging the experts who are actually making money from this. It’s backwards to charge people to find someone who can help them, and then they need to pay that person also!

Varien is stifling the product adoption rate by making it difficult to find and hire experts.

If you want Magento to get the credit it deserves and be used for many websites, then make it EASY for people to use it. This includes finding people to help.

If this is not resolved the web will simply find another way. Simple as creating a Magento forum. Or PM’ing people privately. Instead of forcing your customers to hide in the shadows, embrace them. Don’t make it difficult for us just so you can make a buck. There is other ways of making money you know.

 
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RoyRubin
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@Danny Halarewich - making it difficult for you to make a buck? Really? Didn’t we just give you Magento for free. I think we are making it rather easy.

I do realize that the expectations are high, but unfortunately we do have costs and bills to pay. This is the reality. In all honesty, I don’t think we are asking much. If the price is too steep, there are other channels to look for professionals.

 
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Danimaltron
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I find it silly that you are patrolling the forums, deleting posts from people who WANT to use Magento and are looking to pay someone for some help. Why don’t you charge the people getting paid for the work? That sounds reasonable.

Instead you are charging us $75 ($99 in May) to find someone that could help us out with possibly VERY small tasks? There are lots of people that want to use Magento but need a little help. Varien isn’t making it easy for us.

Your model for becoming licensed to offer Magento solutions, etc. is fine. Your model for getting educated about the product is great. But stifling the community of users who are willing to pay people for some help by forcing out another $75 or $99 fee to post an ad for 1 month is holding you back.

Again, make money from the people that are making money from Magento by offering it as a tool.

Yes, you offer Magento for free. That’s great. “Need some help? Well that’s gonna cost you.”

I’m just saying instead of all the rules and time you are wasting patrolling the forums, why not let people connect with eachother in the proper fashion? Or at least make the cost reasonable (sitepoint) for people looking for some help. Or check out how freelanceswitch.com has their job board setup.

$75 (and soon to be $99) to ask for some help is not a good approach. You’re just forcing everyone to use other methods and bypass your system.

 
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lilquit
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$5 to $10 is reasonable. I bet that thing would be full right now if it were $10.  I would have posted already and would probably post quite often for numerous jobs.  At $75 or anything over $15 I will never post. I will just go to GAF and find someone there for free or $5 or whatever it cost there.

 
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Darren Grant
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Not to mention the fact that Magento has zero documentation making bewildered users turn to others who might be able to figure out how the thing works. Perhaps that is their idea for creating a revenue stream, don’t document the software and charge people to ask for help with the software.

Personally I can see this project quickly being forked.

 
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oshipper
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I have to agree here. Unless someone is looking to hire a full time developer, this “Job Board” does not meet their needs. Consider that when a post costs $99 and the “job” may be something as small as an install or fix and cost no more than ~$100. That would be a 100% surcharge. Better off posting requirements on GAF, RAC, etc for free and you also get the additional assurance of ratings and escrow.

Not to mention that deleting posts in what is supposed to be an open source community is never a good idea.

Hopefully Varien will listen to feedback and make adjustments. Maybe a $5 per post to keep it business like. The “pay to view” job postings is also a good idea since I’m sure if a developer generates income on the software they would be happy to pay a subscription for new leads. Could even include access to Job Board as part of the Community Pro membership or partnership levels to make those more attractive. Lots of ways to generate income without stifling participation.

 
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Darren Grant
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I think the idea of paying to view posts is the best model, any developer who wants some paid work would then just subscribe, or maybe the easiest method would be to make it that development requests can only be read by community Pro members to encourage greater take up of pro membership.

 
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norbolig
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Roy and his team has delivered us a great product and oppurtunity with Magento, I think we all agree on that. Thus, I believe we should try to see it a bit more from their side as well - we cannot expect to have everything for free all the time.

Example: The transaction cost for a programmer on RAC is 15% flat. That means, a job listing fee of $99 on the Magento Job Board equals the normal fee for a job worth $ 660 (not even close to a full time job). So, if the job is billed with more than $ 660, we are in fact saving fees.

Also, what makes this job board a bit different from other “Software Buyer boards”, is that at www.magentocommerce.com the user most probably will get free assistance from the Community Forum solving the very SMALL tasks (including free assistance from the Magento Team themselves). If every small “job” or “fix” goes to the JOB Board, maybe the backside of that will be that the now excellent supportive community will be less responsive.

So in my opinion, at least for the typical buiness user, paying a fee of $99 will not be something to make a complaint about.
But again, for some users of Magento, such as a small start-up business or in the non-profits sector, that might be different.

One topic that has not been discussed: If I have paid $99 to post a JOB, but have still not found anyone that can do the job within the 1 month frame / or someone that can do the job within my budget (to be fair, that also happen when I advertise my car for sale, and have to pay for a new listing fee because it is has not been sold within the listing time, but then normally the listing feet is less than $99).

And still, no one is as per today advertising on the JOB Board.

All in all, maybe it is better to let the programmer pay to view the advertisers contact information (as suggested above). Obviously, the fee should then be less than $75. Maybe $5 / $10 or $15 a month, or $75 a year. This will lead to more job listings, and make sure that also this part of ‘Mangento’ will stay within magentocommerce.com.

 
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Darren Grant
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Well using the car analogy what we currently have is we have been given this amazing flash porsche sportscar that runs on LPG but the guy building it didn’t quite finish it so you need to finish assembling it yourself. The trouble is you were not given a workshop manual and porsche in fact don’t publish one so to finish your project you have to find a mechanic to build it for you. Trouble is because it runs on LPG you can’t just ask any old mechanic you have to find one that has experience in the relatively new LPG technology. Trouble is in order to find such a mechanic you have to walk into the garage and put $100 on the table just to find out if any of the mechanics there are able to take on your project.

I agree that Varian are not producing Magento out of the good of their hearts they are doing in it to make themselves a living because previously they were building custom sites using osCommerce that had limitations. They decided that they could build their own commerce system rather than working from the now significantly dated osCommerce core. If the software becomes popular they should do well out of it by building custom solutions for customers. By being the key developer of the software who better to turn to for help with big projects, nice and profitable for Varien.

It is good for them that they are finding other ways to get some income from the project such as the community pro membership but saying “see it a bit more from their side as well” is just not how business works. It is all about customer perception, why do you think people despise companies like Microsoft ? It is because they do things their way without considering the customers perspective. Customers do not expect to bend to fit in with a company (be that right or wrong) they expect corporations to work to their expectations. So what I’m trying to say is that for something to succeed especially in the difficult to please open source community it has to not appear as a blatant way of extracting money. The whole idea of paying to post a single job ad is completely backwards to what people expect but if I were a developer I would probably feel quite happy about buying a community Pro membership so that I could see the posts for help. Because at least I would be getting some other features for my money even if I didn’t get any work out of it. As a user also I might consider buying a Pro membership so I could post requests as I could post a number of requests for various things during the year membership and at the same time get all the other features of the Pro membership. So even if I don’t find a developer I haven’t just blown $100 for a 1 month ad I have paid for a Pro subscription and at least got something out of it.

Having developers pay for a Pro membership would show that they consider it to be an investment to be part of the Magento community. Likewise if people wanting help had to be Pro members it would show they were serious about using magento not just wasting everyones time. This would be better for the end user and I believe for Varien as people are likley to renew their membership each year if Varien makes membership worthwhile. The more Pro members the better their cash flow as there is a constant income from it, not just a one off charge for a single job post.

 
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lilquit
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I emailed magento via their ticket system about their installing the script service for my site. they never wrote back. I guess I am going to GAF. Should be easy to find someone there. I am not tech and cant do it myself.

 
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